#36 The Importance of Marketing in the Equestrian Industry with founder and CEO of Entrigue Consulting, Kelly Artz

[SPEAKER 1]On this week’s episode, we’re talking with Kelly Artz, founder and CEO of Entrigue Consulting.

[SPEAKER 2]Expose ourselves to more people. We really have to think about, like, how are we showing people horse sports? One, what are we telling them about horse sports and and all that? And I think that really comes from marketing and and helping equestrian brands and equestrian businesses to do that is how and tell those stories is how we bring more people into the sport.

[SPEAKER 1]Welcome to the Equestrian Connection podcast from wehorse. My name’s Danielle Crowell, and I’m your host. Kelly founded Entrigue Consulting to combine her skills of production and marketing in an area she’s passionate about. An avid eventer turned FEI dressage rider with a knack for marketing and branding, her connections in American thoroughbred horse racing, dressage, and eventing led her to help equestrian brands and professional riders across horse sports strategize their digital identity. Kelly has represented many Olympians and top riders, and has collaborated with some of the largest organizations in equestrian sports, including the Kentucky Derby, Breeders’ Cup, Adequan Global Dressage Festival, and Longines Global Champions Tour. Be sure to listen for the information on this December’s Ingrid Klimka Masterclass in California. And without further adieu, let’s dive in. Kelly, welcome to the podcast. We’re so excited to have you and to talk all about marketing today. Our first question right off the gate, I’d love to know, I know you have a pretty interesting background. How did you get into horses and what were your first few years like as an equestrian?

[SPEAKER 2]Um, well, I probably grew up as far away from any high performance horse sport that you really could.Um, there are no, you know, there aren’t a lot of big dressage riders or jumpers or anything really where I grew up.

[SPEAKER 1]I, um,

[SPEAKER 2]I saw Karen O’Connor ride at what used to be called Rolex on TV, and I just was like, whoa.I’ve always been really fascinated by horses, and I had done a little Western riding here and there.My grandfather had some ranch horses growing up in the mountains in Colorado. But when I saw that, I was like, wow, that’s the best rider I think I’ve ever seen.I want to learn how to do that, that well.So then I started doing pony club and got really into eventing and spent a lot of years doing eventing.And the rest, I guess, is kind of history from that.I did all the, where I grew up, it snowed a lot in the winter.So it was almost so cold that you couldn’t do like jumping or there weren’t really competitions when it was like that.And so we would do a lot of trail riding and hacking, but then we would do pony club.They would have these things called quiz and different things for rallies.And so I would always end up going to the rallies because my parents didn’t have the money to buy me a horse.And so I’d always end up going to the rallies and being the, there’s like the horse manager.So like in charge of organizing the team and organizing all the horses and helping everyone pack. you know, doing all that kind of stuff and I was really good at it and I got really into that and I think sort of all of those things and then just being involved in eventing and I made me be really, I think, more involved in horse sports and the English disciplines versus the Western disciplines growing up in Colorado because I loved all the horse management, you know, and learning about all the different tack and the different different equipment and different shoes.I just think there’s a big emphasis in the English disciplines that we don’t talk about that much and actually in things like Pony Club that really create good horsemanship.And that was really an area that I started out and spent a long time and really enjoyed.I’d go to all the Pony Club rallies and the shows and help them organize stuff and do all that.And so, yeah, I guess you could say I’m still doing the same thing.

[SPEAKER 1]It’s funny.I also started in Pony Club and I was the opposite of you.I was like, this eventing stuff is way too scary for me.I’m not continuing with it.I was the opposite.It wasn’t, it didn’t draw me in.I was like, I am not, you want me to do what?

[SPEAKER 2]So funny.

[SPEAKER 1]Yeah.

[SPEAKER 2]I mean, you either, I think with eventing, you either, you either have the guts or you don’t, you know, it’s, Either there or not.You’re fearless or you’re definitely like, nope, I don’t want to fall off.

[SPEAKER 1]Absolutely, absolutely.So you transitioned from eventing to dressage.What made you decide to go that route?

[SPEAKER 2]I had a mare that was like a runaway. just one of those horses that I think in some ways like for someone that was that like ballsy eventer that could just like go and she because she was awesome like she would jump anything that you put in front of her and she was smart and quick and And so I think for someone that was just a little insane that could sit there and just like go with her, she was awesome.She would just jump everything.But for me, it was really scary because I didn’t feel like there was, like I didn’t have the ability to have a half halt to position her.And she was a percher on cross, so she was a little bit heavy in the front.And I just always had this terrifying feeling of just like down in the front.And that’s not a good feeling on cross country and over jumps and stuff. Yeah, and I’m, I’m, I think I’m naturally kind of inclined to dressage just my personality type I sort of think that different personalities mesh well with different disciplines and things like that and if you are kind of I think more maybe a perfectionist or OCD and analytical and you like to break things down and you’re good with like I think more like psychology, philosophy like that kind of thing.I mean like dressage is an area where you can I think really enjoy the sport and kind of see it as this like lifelong progression and this lifelong kind of journey whereas It’s not just about the immediate results of, you know, jumping a clean round or jumping around.I think it’s, it’s just a slightly different way of thinking.I guess I’d say it’s like engineering versus art in a way.

[SPEAKER 1]Yeah.Yeah.

[SPEAKER 2]I think just naturally I was always more, I really liked it.I think a lot of eventers and jumpers can sometimes feel like when you’re young, right?Like when you’re a little kid, it’s like, oh, dressage is boring.It’s not as fun as the jumping and someone’s talking at you the whole time.And, um, but I didn’t have that experience.I think, um, because I had really great, even as an event or really, really awesome, um, coaches and mentors that I would, that I worked with, like Holly Bennett and, Buck Davidson that were really like supportive of the dressage and Brian Sabo who had worked really closely with Hilda Gurney so I always had this like like I had really good I’d say mentorship and people that could actually break down some of the more complex dressage terminology or ways of looking at things to a way that was like simple for an introduction in a, in a, in a way that made it so that dressage didn’t feel like, you know, I mean, I sometimes feel like you can, you can, if you want to, you can get so theoretical with dressage that it starts to sound like, well, you just sprinkle fairy dust over the reins and the horse comes around, you know, and like, that’s how it works.And, and, you know, and So I think that that’s, I think that was something that really, and I had good teachers.I think like with any other sub, any subject, it’s not just forces.I think that in any subject where you see any students, not just myself, but students thrive in environments where they have teachers who are passionate and teachers that can also give them confidence in understanding things.And I think that that’s, that’s probably why I fell in love with it as I had really good, good instruction in the beginning and then just was great.This is fun.It feels cool.It feels doable.

[SPEAKER 1]So yeah.Yeah.That’s that’s crucial.I mean, that’s make or break, right.It really determines like your introductory into anything and the people that guide you through it, like that can determine whether you continue or whether you quit.It’s, it’s really crucial.So it’s, it’s good that you had that positive beginning with it. Are you feeling inspired to start introducing dressage movements to your horse?Or do you dream of advancing through the levels?No matter where you and your horse are in your journey, WeHorse can help.Check out WeHorse.com to access over 175 online courses with top trainers from around the world. We have courses on everything from dressage, to groundwork, to show jumping, to bodywork, including specific courses on starting your horse with dressage, learning and practicing specific dressage movements, and all the way up to advancing through the dressage levels.And as a member, you get access to everything in our WeHorse library to watch whenever you want. Oh, and we also have an app, which means you can download a course or a video to watch without Wi-Fi, which is perfect for those days at the barn when you want a quick dose of training inspiration before your ride.So what are you waiting for?Go to WeHorse.com and check out our free seven day trial to access our WeHorse library and see if it’s a good fit for you.We can’t wait to see you in there.And now back to the episode. And now you, so you currently, you have the marketing company Intrigue Consulting.I’d love to talk about how you went the marketing route, your background with that, what inspired you to start Intrigue, and then also there is a pretty heavy focus on equestrian marketing, so how did you get into that as well?It’s a pretty loaded question.

[SPEAKER 2]Well, I actually had a very long period of my life where I did not ride.All I did when I went to university and I got my first degree and then I went on to get my master’s, for the most part, until the second year of my master’s program, was really get an education.I come from a family that horses are a hobby, not a job, that sort of thing.It’s a luxury, not a job, that kind of thing.We’re not I would say not a job path that would be, you know, that they would want to see me do from a financial perspective.Um, so I was never encouraged or supported, especially once it was like time to start spending money on university and things like that.So I actually, and I traveled a lot.So, um, my second year of grad school, when we were deciding what to do for, um, thesis films, cause I have a MFA from UCLA.Um, I started, that was when I think the, At the time, I wouldn’t have said, oh yeah, this could be something I was going to do.But I think that’s when the seed was really planted.Because I started doing, I decided to do my thesis film on female jockeys, just partially because I was fascinated by horse racing.I didn’t really know, I had no connections in horse racing. but I thought it was cool.And I was really interested in like why we never see women really in that space dominating.And I thought, well, there’s a really cool story there in terms of making a documentary as a thesis.So then I ended up, I had a screenwriting professor that introduced me to Angie Stevens, who was, I’d say was a really big influence in my career and got me sort of, the wheels turning in my head of how could how could this work in the sports I like not just racing right in dressage and eventing and jumping and stuff and so Angie is the owner and founder of Meticulous Talent and she’s married to Hall of Fame jockey Gary Stevens so she represents jockeys like Mike Smith and Victor Espinosa she puts together a lot of the like you know big sponsorships for the triple crown races and things like that so she agreed to mentor me um for my thesis and helped me get access to all the different racetracks and I worked with a few of her um jockeys her female jockey Chantal Sutherland and Kayla Straw to film that documentary and I just in the process of doing that I spent so much time around horse people again and I was like I just like this like I would just rather be here than you know sitting in a studio only or sitting in a um just in an office or, you know, that kind of thing.So, and I, and at the same time I was, I had fully, I love being creative and I loved film, but I had also really learned that to be very successful in the film industry, you have to, I mean, it is a very dog eat dog.Like it has to be 24 seven.If you want to get a big break, it has to be, you have to be like what you eat, breathe and sleep every single day.And if you’re not willing to shut up for free, like don’t even try to do it as a career.Cause you’re just, it’s brutal. So for me, I was like, that I love being creative and I love the film, but there wasn’t enough for me to be like, I want to do that every day. I feel like I had always known what my first love was, which was horses, but my parents had really, you know, encouraged me to get an education and explore other avenues.And so because of that, I had kind of gotten a little lost.So I felt like I came back on track.And I think, you know, after that, I had all these filmmaking skills, and I had all this education.I was, I started working in, after I graduated, I started working in advertising production consulting, and I worked for on some pretty big accounts like Gatorade, PepsiCo, Hershey’s, Google, things like that, where I really got to learn a lot about the advertising production and that sort of side.And that kind of got me a little bit more into social media and things like that.And it was right when all that was starting to, I mean, I’ve had the company now for a little over eight years, I think I’ve been doing stuff now.So that was right when kind of Instagram and social media in the equestrian space was taking off. Um, and so I really, I saw a little bit of an opportunity there and I, from all my experience in the non equestrian world, I actually had a lot of value to bring to some of these equestrian brands and, and just contacts that I had, cause I had started to ride again, I was meeting more people and, and so everything just sort of came together at once in this, um, sort of. place where at the same time I had that mare who was a bit of a runaway and I had moved to work with a dressage trainer full-time with her to try to like get her to the point where I could compete her successfully in eventing and then everything just sort of came together and I started working more and more in dressage and then it just it was like all these things came together at once to make it happen so that’s that’s really how Intrigue was formed was just like trying to do just trying to help people out, just trying to help a trainer out with a website, trying to help the saddle company that I bought my saddle from, seeing if I could work off some of my stuff and things like that till eventually it was, I’d replaced my income from my other job and couldn’t have two at that point.So it was time to make a go at it as a business for sure.

[SPEAKER 1]I love that.I love how scrappy horse girls are.We’re just, it’s such a, There’s like you said, there’s a personality type to different disciplines.I also think there’s a personality type to being an equestrian.Like you, you’re just you’re, you’re a go getter.So I love that story.Now, in what ways do you think that the marketing or that marketing in general is important to the success of the equestrian industry?

[SPEAKER 2]Well, I think that Marketing in large part is really like the bridge that we as equestrians and I would say high performance have to the rest of the world.It is a very expensive sport.It’s a very niche sport.I think it can be very intimidating for people to get involved in if they don’t know anyone. I think sometimes maybe the easiest experience or the first connection that you make might not necessarily be, you know, the best one and stuff.So I think marketing is really important because it helps, I would say, it helps non-equestrians find equestrians, first off.So trainers, riding schools, businesses that are marketing, you know, whether or not they have lessons or a livery or they’re doing their boarding horses or even trail rides or even just pony camps in the summer for kids.I mean, that’s the future of our sport.These are the future consumers of, you know, saddles and bridles and all that.And so for me, I think You know, marketing is the face.It’s like the makeup.It’s the face of our, of our sport.It’s the face of our industry.It’s the first thing that somebody new sees.And I think in that way, it’s really important to think about as an industry, like what are the stories that we’re telling?Cause I think there can sometimes be this huge gap between. high-performance and just a normal person and and the sport needs more people to come be coming in from the outside it’s getting you know access is getting more and more basically, like the cost of entry to our sport is getting more and more expensive, right?So to expose ourselves to more people, we really have to think about like, how are we showing people horse sports, one, what are we telling them about horse sports, and, and all that.And I think that really comes from Marketing and and helping equestrian brands and equestrian businesses to do that is how and tell those stories is how we we bring more people into the sport and and also help people to navigate the sport and understand. how to treat care for their horses even I think you know even look at like working with brands and and product education and I mean there’s so much we just we live in a time where I mean like everybody and their mother thinks that they can be a TikTok influencer and an entrepreneur and they want to go and make a product and mass produce it and sell it online.And so I think that the conversations that we’re having with consumers, you know, about these products that they will use on there versus inequality and how to use them and when to use them is really important for the brands that want to last. and also for the happiness of recreational riders, the happiness of owners, and the happiness of horses as a whole.Because not every horse is going to be at the Olympics next year, but the thing is, without the rest of those horses that are not going to the Olympics, we have no industry.We have no horse economy, you know, like the, the, the horses going to the Olympics or competing, doing the Kentucky Derby and stuff like that.They make up a tiny fraction of the horses that consume, let’s say all the feed for feed companies, all the supplements.That’s, that’s barely a market for a lot of these, these businesses.So, um, I think that it’s the storytelling side that bridges this gap and, and creates a sense of community.And for me, that’s what marketing is.

[SPEAKER 1]Yeah, yeah, absolutely.And what challenges do you feel that the riding community currently faces?And do you have any opinions on ways that marketing could help to improve it?

[SPEAKER 2]Well, we always talk about like, I would say cost of access, right?So we see the cost of access is definitely going up. And the other thing I’d say is that we’re kind of moving into a world, not just horses, it’s just like everything, right, with like these, I would say like the woke challenges and the discussion of whether or not our sport is humane.I think, you know, the behavior of some of the athletes on the world stage right now and in the past few years has been there have been some that in a way you want to say like you’re ruining it for everyone else right because like we you know we do see horses that are not being treated you know with dignity and respect I think in terms of um you know like what happened that the um It was the pentathlon at the last games and how upsetting that was for basically the world to watch.Our governing bodies are under an enormous amount of pressure now to justify training techniques and to try to show just even the larger sport bodies like the IOC like what are we doing to make sure that the horse’s welfare is protected and then but but it’s such a small industry it’s such a small sport and there’s such a disconnect from you know the way that horses are trained there’s different styles there’s different different builds even of horses, just all kinds of different things that that make all of that very complex, you know, and then you do have, I think, when we’re looking at high performance, we have horses that are competing at, you know, like, for instance, the Olympic medal and things, Olympic level and things like that.But, I mean, you don’t see a human Olympic athlete that’s getting that level that doesn’t have some sort of, you know, injury or setback either.And so, we’re walking a very fine line, I think in high performance sports, because we’re asking the horses to do something and they can’t tell us how they feel.So I think for me, where, where marketing sort of fits into that is like, How do we tell people about our sport?What do we want to say?Are the people that are winning, are they showing harmony with their horses?Are they examples of the types of horses that we want to be breeding for the future, for the next generation of riders?I think horse racing is an interesting case study in that. in the past 20 years or so the horses have been bred so light right like they just kept breeding horses lighter and lighter and lighter and lighter and like a thoroughbred back in the day would have these, you know, big, thick, you know, I’ve seen some of these like older inventors, even like 20, 30, I mean, big, strong horses now, but then in an effort to just be so competitive.And I think in America, especially in the West, we have this like, hyper competitive sort of thing going on of like, we must win at all costs kind of thing.And, and I think that’s very dangerous line to walk with the horses.And I think that as much as the governing bodies are really trying to put rules in place and things like that.I think in terms of digital media and social media and the media and things like that, the stories that we’re starting to tell are going to be the things that dictate whether or not our sports exist in the future, I think, or if they’re deemed inhumane.I mean, like, look at, I mean, we’re not going to see any more orca whales in captivity. activity for the rest of our lives, which means that like, you know, my grandchildren will never be able to see an orca whale probably ever, you know, unless it’s off the side of a boat, which I don’t know if there’s something wrong with that.I, you know, like it’s, I think zoos and things like that have a big purpose in educating, you know, the next generation on how to care for our planet.Like if you don’t see an animal and see how beautiful it is and see how it interacts, you’re less likely to, you know, hair, for instance, about whether or not you’re dumping all your trash into the ocean, right?Like, it’s these sorts of things.I think we’re just we’re walking this fine line.And, and with horses, you know, we’re looking at animals that like, I’m sorry, they they can’t live in the wild anymore.They don’t live out there very well.You know, they’ve at least the warm bloods and things won’t I mean, these horses have been domesticated for, you know, years and years and years, and they’ve built civilization with us.So it’s kind of like dogs.I mean, as much as you know, you want my you want to be like, Oh, yeah, you can’t put my poodle in the woods, like she’ll be tomorrow, you know, like, So we, because of the relationships that we have with horses and dogs and some of these animals and our history, we owe them, you know, a place, I think, in our future.And that does, that welfare discussion is going to, I think, keep coming up while the governing bodies of sports are going to have to figure out how to make sure that We’re, you know, eliminating situations where the welfare of our competitive forces can even be questioned by the public.I don’t think that we should have, you know, I don’t think that that should even be something that should be questioned from outside of how how they’re treated.And I think that comes. That really comes from the stories that we tell from the riders that we elevate from the images that we, you know, as a community talk about and and show people and and things like that in our sports and I think that I do think that marketing plays a role in that, you know. what gains traction, what doesn’t.

[SPEAKER 1]Absolutely.We just last week, we horse here, we had a live event with Linda Tellington-Jones and Sabine Choudhury.And it was so fantastic.And I know that, you know, Sabine on a personal level and you’ve worked with Sabine as well.Is that correct?Yeah.Yeah.And I have to say that in terms of a professional top level athlete, It is so refreshing and wonderful to have those athletes that are at the top and truly are in the sport for the right reasons.They are here for the horse.There’s harmony with the horses.You know that our younger generations coming up can look to them and see somebody doing it right.And I just have to say that, you know, The Sabine Choukaris, the Ingrid Klimkas, you know, we’re very big fans of them here at WeHorse and they are top level athletes that are doing things right and those stories are so lovely to see from a marketing perspective of you know, how their horses are living.Yeah, a bit of a tangent, but I just have to say that it’s just nice.

[SPEAKER 2]Yeah, I mean, I think that it’s not a coincidence that they’re, you know, I mean, those are results of being kind of the German system.And, you know, that there is, I think, a cultural, I mean, like, my family’s German, I also have a German passport.There’s an attitude of, if you’re going to do something right, you know, if you’re going to do something, do it right, you know, take pride in it.I think that Germany has really just as a culture, a lot of respect for horses and just animals in general and how they’re treated and I think that, I mean, the Germans are on top of their stuff no matter where they are right like they’re on time, they’re organized, they’re could you know they’re just i mean i live in europe so i see all the different you know cultures even now that uh that you interact with germans are always like black and white like it’s great and i think that um you know and like you said with the welfare of the horses that’s it’s a really big thing but there’s a huge emphasis in in that culture i think with like no shortcuts you know like just get to go and and and go get on the on an amazing Grand Prix or if you don’t know how to, you know, if you don’t know how to ride, I think, you know, they have the entire, like the rider system.And, you know, in all of the different the different kind of education system similar to Pony Club, there’s like rigid, structure and emphasis and so these you know this this pay to play let me bypass an education of being a horseman and win a bunch of ribbons and then people will think I’m a horse trainer and I can therefore go and you know have a business that’s scary you can’t do that in Germany they go where’s your credentials you know and I think Sabine’s a beautiful example of that I mean she’s you know she’s devoted her whole life to um just training horses.I mean, like, the some of the things that she can train horses to do, not even as a dressage rider, but all of her background as an exhibition rider.I mean, if you get a chance to see any of that, I mean, Sabine’s done some really incredible stuff as an exhibition rider, and in performances and things like that.And the things she, you know, and her husband’s also a very good horse trainer in a lot of that stuff.And so, you know, you look at like the Klimkas and I mean, just the effort that Reiner put into creating an educational platform for the next generation, I mean, that has completely outlived him.And now you see it in that Ingrid is continuing to push that forward.And, you know, I mean, even her daughter now, I think we’ll see that even after Ingrid is no longer writing and, you know, in the future as well.I mean, it’s just this emphasis on on the horses and and I and you know you love to see I think the one thing that’s really cool too in the dressage side of things is that you see how long a lot of these riders have been with with these horses the ones that that really make us go those horses you know those people we are like I mean like Sabine had Sanseo since he was three I mean how long has has Ingrid had Franziskus you know like I mean Gareth Hughes has had Braylinka since she was four.Now these horses are on the world stage.But I think that’s the beauty of, I think, some of these older… Germans are systematic with everything.And I think that shows in the education with those riders that you admire so much.I think that everything comes from this system, if that makes any sense.

[SPEAKER 1]Absolutely, yeah.Yeah, no, we’re big fans. of the two of them.And so speaking of Ingrid Klimka, you’re going to be doing a masterclass with Ingrid in California in December, which is very exciting.Can you give us any insight into that masterclass, how the event came to be, what people can expect, any of those details? Sure.

[SPEAKER 2]I mean, like, I’ve absolutely, like, idolized Ingrid for a really long time.I just think she’s amazing.Like, her father was a genius.And I, I think that I’ve always loved even as an eventer, her Cavaletti, you know, programs, and I had all the books and… Yeah, we have so many Cavaletti courses here on on Wee Horse with Ingrid.

[SPEAKER 1]There’s just there’s so much Cavaletti content.She’s the queen of it.

[SPEAKER 2]Well and I think you know it’s it I mean something to consider too is just the fact that you know like like like Reiner had so much knowledge on the veterinary side of of the horses too so I think all of that has been kind of you know she basically uses his system still and and and that combined with with kind of his veterinary knowledge everything like that you’re really seeing how the horses are worked in a way that’s biomechanically healthy for them and then also like coming from his background like if you really look back at like the great horsemen you know that came before that we’re we’re looking at the the men who actually were trying to train these horses to ride them in the last wars that were fought on horseback, right?And the strength that a horse would need just in its top line and the longevity and the soundness they had to maintain in being able to march across countries, you know, and continents and stuff is enormous.And so when you look at where the knowledge has come from and all that, and then you see this system now that’s in like a lot of those books and You know, things like that.I mean, I think that’s what’s really cool.And when I when I started talking to Ingrid and her team about coming to California, I said, you know, that, you know, we were talking about, like, what kind of program do we really want to put together for for California?And I think one of the things that It’s very different when you work with a lot of these, I would say, high-level riders, but the ones that have done it on multiple horses.We’re not talking about somebody who bought a horse and won a medal.We’re talking about someone who has produced three, four, five Grand Prix horses that are competitive at the level, you know, doing that. if you look at those people they and this was actually a conversation I had with Sabine when she was mentoring me before I moved to England to ride with Gareth was you know that there’s a system and you follow that system and every horse should be able to go through that system and then depending on the quality of that horse they’ll be able to still be happy in their job, but they’ll reach wherever they’re going to reach within that system, but they’ll have a certain proficiency, right?And so when I started to design the program with Ingrid and her team, the conversation was, I would like to showcase a system.It’s important for me that we showcase a systematic progression. what are we looking for at these levels with the different horses and how do we use the different exercises or the different cabaletti exercises for instance in order to you know assess that like whether or not that be balance or self-carriage or like at this level so it’s So it was really important to me that throughout the clinic, we have a systematic progression.So people can really see from a like, and I just keep going back to this word, but like on a systematic level, how horses can move through training, because I think it’s very easy to get lost. in framing horses and when you’re looking at how to be competitive and what wins ribbons and what doesn’t and different judging and things like that.And so I think that was our big thing was we wanted, I wanted to showcase a system for the audiences that they could take away to back to their own horses and Ingrid and her team loved the idea and so then we sat down from there and and it was about you know we had over 50 applications to ride with her which was really exciting and we decided to We watched, you know, the videos of the horses and then based on the different levels and where we could put horses and really evaluated wanting to show different types of horses also to the audience that are at different levels, some that are proficient in certain levels and some that are still schooling at those levels so that we can show, you know, how basically really show the process, right?Because I think that’s what, you know, makes we all have seen the finished product, right?Like we’ve all watched, you know, Charlotte and, and the leg row to train your dragon and we go, whoo, but none of us are like, okay, well, what does that look like on day one when you ask it to pee off, you know, like, because it didn’t look like that.I know it didn’t, you know, it’s one of those things where We really wanted to do that, and so I think the program is going to be really exciting.We’ve got an awesome range of horses.We’ve got two Olympians riding.Sabine Shukeri is going to ride.Tammy Smith is also going to ride.And that was what also was really exciting, was we have a mixture of horses in the clinic of eventers and dressage riding. because Ingrid’s big thing is like, there really isn’t and there shouldn’t be this huge difference between the sports in terms of the classical system and the way the horses are trained classically.So yeah, maybe the dressage horses, they don’t know how to jump as big, right?Or we don’t jump them as big. But, and they don’t do cross country, but at the same time in terms of the foundation and activities that we’re going to be doing inside the arena to look at the phases of training, there’s no reason we shouldn’t be able to do that with both eventers and dressage horses.So we actually have a few groups that are kind of exciting that are, we have a dressage rider and an eventing horse in the same same level so you can see different types of horses too because You know dressage horse that’s only doing dressage.It’s gonna have different muscle structure different suppleness then a horse that is doing You know the highest level of like a third level dressage horse is doing the highest level of inventing, you know so the fitness is it’s going to be different and and I would say that hotness of the horse, I mean, all these things.So it’s going to, I think it’s going to lead to some really interesting conversations.And then again, seeing how these horses can, can go through the classical system and where, how they can, they can all get that process in the same way.So that was, that’s really exciting.I mean, overall, it’s going to be a super fun event.We only have a few VIP tables left, so it’s going to be a pretty packed event.We’re going to have over two days, we’ll have, lovely catered breakfast, catered lunch.She’s going to do autographs and book signings both days during lunch.We’re going to do a Q&A with the writers and Ingrid and the VIP.There’s like a private VIP Q&A meet and greet at the end of the first day.We’re going to have an awesome kind of Christmas vendor village.It’s right before Christmas at the end of show season.So I think We’ve got a lot of awesome vendors, and the food will be great, and it’s in Temecula, so the weather is going to be, you know, it’ll be probably nice, we hope.And so, yeah, and Galway is amazing, the facility where the event’s going to take place.They’ve put so much, there’s just been so much that’s gone into it in the past few years with Ali Neel Farooshan, and the footing’s fantastic.I mean, we have a permanent VIP pavilion, like, it’ll be heated. So it’s gonna be a really, I think, fun event for everyone to get to just watch.We’re gonna have raffles going throughout the whole day, I think. It’ll be a really fun, interactive day with just tons of different horses, different levels, different Cavaletti exercises.I think that people are just going to be so much to take in over such a short period of time.Absolutely.

[SPEAKER 1]It sounds like it’s going to be so good.I know you said there’s only a few VIP tables left, but is there still just general admission tickets available?

[SPEAKER 2]Yeah, so we still have general admission tickets available for you can buy both days or you can buy Saturday and Sunday individually if you can only come one day.And then we do still have VIP tickets, single tickets for sale that you can buy.It’s just right at this point, they’re first come first serve.So as soon as we sell out of those tables, they’re just gone.But the prices on all individual tickets will go up October 1st.

[SPEAKER 1]Okay, so this episode will be coming up before October 1st, so that’s good for everybody listening.And we’ll make sure to put the link to all of that in the podcast description, so everybody can check that out if they are interested.

[SPEAKER 2]One more exciting thing I think that people should know is that we’re also going to raffle off Ingrid has her own Cavalettis that she’s designed.They’re coming all the way from Germany so at the end of the you can purchase raffle tickets during the event and at the end of the event you’ll be able to potentially someone’s going to win Ingrid’s Cavalettis.

[SPEAKER 1]from Germany.That’s so cool.That’s really cool.Hopefully it is somebody that’s local because that would be hard to fly home.But that is really, really cool.

[SPEAKER 2]I mean, we shipped them all the way from Germany.

[SPEAKER 1]That’s true.

[SPEAKER 2]Figure it out.

[SPEAKER 1]That’s true.I love it.It sounds like it’s going to be such a cool event. So our listeners, if they are, let’s say, a equestrian business owner, a trainer, maybe a influencer, anybody that is on social media for any reason, do you have any tips you could give to increase their marketing efforts, things that they could be doing that are simple little tricks that you might have an insight on?

[SPEAKER 2]I think the biggest thing is to make sure your website’s in a good place.That’s probably the most important thing.If your budget is small and you’re doing a lot of your social media yourself and you’re doing your branding yourself, like you’re editing your own reels, you don’t really have the money to do, let’s say, paid ads on social media, that’s okay.I would say the most important thing is to make sure your website’s working for you because that’s going to be the thing that can help you grow your business so that you can have some budget to spend on Let’s say some small marketing efforts like email marketing with different groups or some paid ads, things like that.I see a lot of people that try to build their website themselves and that area, they do not do that.Find someone to help you build it and do the SEO and make sure that you’re going to rank with search engines because that’s really how you’re going to be able to build your business and make sure you have like a good Google business profile and things those are those are key those are I’d say the two biggest ones is like do you have a Google business profile and can people find you when they Google you via your website and then when they get to your website are they lost Because I think sometimes people use too many photos or there’s enough copy and so make sure, like, is your website clear?

[SPEAKER 1]Is it easy?

[SPEAKER 2]I mean, we all navigate websites all the time.We’ve all been looking for something we can’t find on someone’s website and it’s not a good feeling.So I think in terms of that, that would be the biggest thing.It’s just really You know, focus your resources on your website and with everything else, you can do it yourself if you are just consistent.And that’s where you really, as an entrepreneur or business owner, you have to kind of evaluate your time and where your time is best spent on a financial level.And like, you know, When you get to the point where you’re too busy with your clients and your customers to remember to post every day on social media, or if you’re just too busy and you’re not well, consistency is really important with social media.Consistency is really important with email marketing and things like that.So if you’re not able to do it at that point, you really want to try to start to set aside a marketing budget.And that’s the other thing too, is like, I think as entrepreneurs, I think we often forget that, um, our. Marketing really is an area of our business.Just like if you were, you know, if you own a yard and you are, you know, going to maintain the footing and you’re going to maintain the driveway and make sure that you’re, you know, doing the upkeep to make sure that the, um, that the, that the business can operate to take care of the horses.I think at the same time, you have to be doing enough marketing to make sure that you have an incoming stream of clients and that you have Um, you know, new leads coming in and that people can find you and, and that’s something that will help you get sponsors and gain traction.And, and the other thing is, is it really takes time, you know, to build momentum for a business and marketing.So, um, The, the faster you, you blow big, sure you, you kind of implode as well, I would say.So the big thing is just like consistency and slow and steady really wins the race when it comes to marketing online.

[SPEAKER 1]Yeah, absolutely. Do you have any lessons or insights that you’ve learned from your experiences that have had like any sort of a lasting impact on your career?

<p>[SPEAKER 2]I’d say I think when I first started the business and what I see a lot with entrepreneurs that come to me or small businesses or startups is they want me, even as a consultant, I see this like people want me to lay out like a five-year plan or a two-year plan for them. The one thing I’ll say that I now know in the core of my being, so I don’t have any sort of anxiety or stress about it, is that’s impossible.Because so many areas of marketing are dependent on… There’s so many other variables, so many other factors, so many… It’s kind of like saying, okay, you want to look at a three-year-old and know that it’s going to become a Grand Prix horse.You want to look at a three-year-old and know that it’s going to be able to jump a six-foot fence. Well, that’s great, but there’s 27,000,000 other things that could happen in between now and then and opportunities and things like that, you know, affect where you go, how far you go and things like that.And so I think for for me, one of the most important things to learn is to just sort of. you know, there’s like this thing of just chop wood, you know, like, just, just put your head down, just just be consistent, do your work, focus on what you can do today, focus on what you can do tomorrow, try to plan ahead for next week, and next month, and the next six months, as much as you can.But don’t, like, in my opinion, nothing in your business plan should be you should be more committed to than one year.Like if you can’t deviate within a year into say, exploring another avenue or doing whatever, like for instance, for years I have worked on different master classes for brands.I’ve worked in different sponsorship areas for horse shows.I mean, I just decided last year, all right, we’re going to explore this.I’m going to do my own, you know, with the Ingrid Klimka.I’m going to organize it and host it myself. Um, but if you would ask me that when I started intrigue, if I would do that, I would say, probably not because I have.All there’s there’s a certain element of financial risk involved.You need to have a lot of organization, but now I have so much more information.So many more contacts so many more. connections and experience doing all these little things that that’s not a reach for me.And so I think that’s the same thing for businesses.You don’t know who you’re going to meet.You don’t know what opportunities are going to come your way.You don’t know what your customer is going to need.Like, you know, I think you see it a lot in fashion, right?Somebody designs something and they think this is amazing.This is going to be really, this is going to sell out like crazy.And then nobody buys it.But then the one thing you thought wouldn’t, you know, nobody really be interested in just takes off and that you end up continuing to explore that direction.So I think don’t be so committed to your business plan, that you lose touch with actually like, how can you be a value to your customer?How can you actually be a value in in the market and what’s going on?Because I think that You know, don’t try to be a fortune teller, basically.Just try to work where you’re needed.</p><p>[SPEAKER 1]Yeah, that’s good advice.I liked when you had said about you don’t know who you’re going to meet. You know, it’s so true that like you don’t know what opportunities are going to come your way.And so if you’re so stuck and so rigid in something, then you may miss out or it could, you know, it’s just it’s it’s good to be flexible.So I like that.That’s good advice.</p><p>[SPEAKER 2]Well, and I think, too, it’s not even that it’s like you get the answers as you go.When it comes to running a business, you really get the answers as you go.You get the resources as you grow.And so it just sort of will start Things that have felt like, oh my God, that would be so impossible, you know, five years ago, now are like just part of your everyday existence.And so don’t, don’t get so lost, you know, because otherwise you’re just going to turn around and go the other way.That’s what people do.</p><p>[SPEAKER 1]Absolutely.</p><p>[SPEAKER 2]I think a lot of people talk them out of things that could make them really happy.But, you know, we’ve sort of got this culture now of if it’s not easy, then it’s not meant for me.Or, you know, everything needs to be good vibes all the time.And I wasn’t raised that way.So, you know, sometimes you have to be a little uncomfortable in the short term for what’s going to be best in the long term.</p><p>[SPEAKER 1]Yeah. Yeah, you’re right.Absolutely.So you work with a lot of top riders and big brands.And I know that working in the equestrian industry, it can kind of get easy to get caught up in other people’s goals.So I’m thinking of trainers, and they get so invested in their students’ goals that sometimes they forget to dedicate time to their own goals and training their own horses and those sorts of things. And I’m sure that, you know, in your line of work, it can also be easy to get caught up in other people’s things.Like you had said, doing the masterclass for so many other people and, you know, now you’re just deciding to do one for yourself. I know that you do have your own big personal goals with your horses.So how important do you think it is to separate your personal goals from your business and to make time for that when you’re so invested in other people’s?</p><p>[SPEAKER 2]I mean, I think it’s one of those things where you don’t have to blow out someone else’s candle.If you blow out somebody else’s candle, it’s not going to make yours burn any brighter.I think we see a lot of jealousy in the sport, especially with the horses, how expensive they are now.It’s so easy to get in your woe is me and so-and-so has an owner that can spend so many dollars on horses.It’s just easy.It’s just easy to go there.Then I think on the flip side, you also have that where you’re that running around ragged after all your amateur clients.And I’ve now seen clients that have kind of been on both sides of that, right?I’ve seen clients that are so incredibly focused on their own career goals and their own writing that they’ve become extremely unhappy, actually, and miserable because there’s so much pressure. Like, I mean, the pressure that some of these higher performance riders are under, they’ll, you know, they’ll tell you it’s not fun.It’s really not fun.Like you dream of this your whole life, but you’re, it’s not fun.And then, um, and then, but then the other side, you see these, these, like you said, um, people who can’t really, um, they can’t really have their own riding because they’re running around after everyone else all the time.I think for me. I, I think this is going to sound weird, but like, I think because I came, I spent so much time outside of the equestrian industry for a little bit.I have a little bit more of the ability to compartmentalize areas of my life.Like, like I, yes, I have my own riding career.I have my own riding goals and my, um, my business and my work that I do to make money finances, those horses, right.And finances those dreams.</p><p>[SPEAKER 1]And.</p><p>[SPEAKER 2]But my serving those riders and serving those brands to the best of my ability and helping them in no way makes it so that I am not able to ride my own horses or compete my own horses.And it’s all a matter of like, figuring out how to prioritize your day and how to prioritize your time.I once heard this thing of how a successful person has the ability, someone who’s really successful and at peace, has the ability to make anybody they’re in a room with feel like they’re the most important person in the room.That for me, I think is really important.I always want my clients to feel like I’m their agent, I’m their manager, I’m their marketing director and I’m 100% in and I’m you know and I’m with them all the way and I’m backing them and I think the only way you can do that is if you have a really good sense of like what you’re doing yourself.If you haven’t sat down and you don’t know what you want for your own goals and you don’t have plan to get there for yourself, then you’re going to get distracted and you’re going to get emotional and caught up in whether or not it’s like jealousy or or feeling like you’re being taken advantage of or depleted and things like that.I think the most important thing is like know what you want, have a plan for yourself, Figure out how you know, where’s the money come from?Where does the time come from for that?That’s black and white and then the rest of the time you you have to figure out how to help other people because You know like we’re not here I just believe I really profoundly believe that if you have skills and you have the ability to whether or not you’re a trainer and you can teach clients or you’re a coach and you can actually be a coach and mentor people and Or like in my case, I have all this knowledge of kind of creative and marketing and things like that, that I can help these riders to run businesses and things like that. it does me no good to just keep that inside myself, you know, and I think, and you do, you have to really be able to ground yourself if you get distracted and say, wait a minute, their candle, my candle, they’re not the same thing, you know, like, it’s, I really believe like, it where we go is not really up to us in that regard and so you have to you have to you have to prioritize other people and their dreams and and I think for me I really see all of that as like serving horses in general in more of like a metaphysical and spiritual sense you know by by helping other people to enjoy their horses and enjoy um whatever, you know, if a trainer is is helping their clients or, or all that, I think that’s really, you know, do you want to have meaning or not, you know, if it’s just about you, and just about winning on the competitive side, you’re not going to be happy very long and you’re not going to be able to find a balance to things.But at the same time, if you’re only running around and people are taking advantage of you, and you feel like you’re not working towards your own goals, you’re not setting that time aside for yourself, and you’re not trying to learn and better yourself and have a direction for yourself, then, you know, I think, and that’s what it is, it’s this balance.And I think it can be very difficult for for equestrians to find it’s actually an area where I think the equestrian industry really needs to improve not just in how we not I mean like the horses are so demanding right like they need so much care on a daily basis between the food and the water and the riding and the time and just how much it takes financially out of everyone to own a horse you know owning a horse is a huge thing for a lot of people and in terms of how their family or them or they spend their finances and stuff and I think you know we do have to um if you want to stay in it in the long run if you want to be happy in the long run you have to have I think like other areas of of your life.And I see this all the time with businesses.I have clients that will come to me that we do a lot of hiring, recruiting, and consulting for that kind of stuff as well.And one of the things we get told is, oh, it’s so hard for us to find good help.Can you help us find good help?Can you help us find good help?And the first thing that we do is, when we do recruiting and hiring ads and things like that, is we look at, OK, what’s the job description?Is the wage something that is realistically livable?Because a lot of times, it’s not, to be honest.It’s not. Do you have two days a week off?And you’ll look at this and in some of these programs, they’ll say, no, you get one day a week off.And I’m like, Who can survive with that?You know, like you need a like, do you want to have this person?How long do you want to have this person in this job?And they’ll be like, well, we’d like it to be a long term.I’m like, you’re going to get them for six months, a year.</p><p>[SPEAKER 1]It’s funny that you say that I worked as like the the head person of a barn across the country when I was 20.And so it was a it was a really, really big position for me.I was super excited.And I lasted six months because there They’re literal words where horses don’t take a day off, so neither do you.So I lived on the property, I worked for the farm, and I didn’t have a day off, and I lasted six months. You know, I moved all the way across the country.I had to move all the way home because it was just like, this isn’t, this isn’t sustainable.It’s like, no one can survive this way.</p><p>[SPEAKER 2]It’s not sustainable.And the same thing on the financial level.Do you know what I mean?You see, you see these girls that’ll be working and they’ll basically be like, well, basically you live here and we give you grocery money, you know, and. And that’s it.And you’re like, okay, but they have to pay for their cell phone.Like they’re 25.They should probably start saving some for retirement.How can you build a foundation?Again, do you want this to be, how long do you want this person, this position?If you want it to be an internship and you want to have to spend all the time to train this person and you’re going to have some good, some bad, you know, whatever. then it’s great.Or the only other people who can take these positions are kids whose parents support them for X amount of years.And then they wonder why they are not able to work very hard.And it’s like, well, you’re you’re trying to hire from a pool that doesn’t necessarily have to work in the same way to make money.And so, you know, yeah, I think it’s one of those things.I think it’s important to find balance in your life and like balance in in the way you work and your time and all of that.So like, you know, for instance, social media runs for seven days a week in the vein that you just got told, you know, I have to come up with other ways, you know?Yeah, like, do we get called in sometimes after business hours or on a weekend for a post or for something like that?Once in a while, yes.But we try to establish a foundation with our clients that, you know, we don’t work on the weekends.And so we try to plan everything.We have software, AI, stuff that goes out, but if they want to make a last minute plan or something like that on their social, sometimes that involves them doing something, you know?And I think it’s the same thing in a barn.Like a lot of times these places are just grossly understaffed.And if you’re not going to have, like, you should have enough staff that you can have coverage to give people adequate days off so that they can maintain their health.Because I, I think a lot of times people won’t, they don’t stay healthy when you only work, when you work like that, you know? So I think that, I think that for me, it’s a little bit about, you know, yes, you have to be of service to other people, but if you’re not taking care of yourself and you’re not taking days off and you’re not, you know, yeah.</p><p>[SPEAKER 1]Yeah.Not to be cheesy, but it goes back to that whole quote of like, um, you have like on the airplane, you have to put your oxygen mask on before you help anybody else and you know, whatever.And I do feel as though, um, if you are, you know, working so hard to help somebody else achieve their goals that it is taking away from the things that bring you joy. It’s not, it’s not going to work.It’s not going to work out.And you, you have to find that space in your life and dedicate that time to have the things that bring you joy.And then if you, you know, take that hour a day or a couple hours a day or a few hours a week or something like that to, to fill yourself up, you’re going to go to that job or you’re going to go to that client or whatever with so much more energy and enthusiasm than if you just only gave everything to them. Um, you know, you’re going to deplete yourself.So I, yeah, I, I agree.It’s, I think that it’s so important to have your own goals and your own dreams.Um, you know, when working within the equestrian industry in any industry that you are, you know, have a passion in.</p><p>[SPEAKER 2]Yeah, definitely any any industry for sure.And I think we have to get out of a culture where, you know, like, I think you have to get out of a culture where this idea of like, well, we walked uphill both ways to school, you know, like that’s no, you didn’t.And if how long did it last for you?And what happened when you know, like, we need to ask these questions better.I mean, I think that there there’s hard workers for sure, and I’m definitely one of them.And I mean, like I’ve worked plenty of 15 hour days, both in horses and the film industry, and I’ve done them for weeks on end.But I think, yeah, I think that as a whole in the equestrian industry, that’s one thing we really need to start to have more conversations about, you know, if we’re going to care about the welfare of our horses, and we also need to start to set some standards for the welfare of the, I think the people in the sport as well, you know? all the way from the staff to the client experiences.I mean, we’re about to have a massive shortage of veterinarians in the United States, for instance.</p><p>[SPEAKER 1]Why?</p><p>[SPEAKER 2]Because it’s not exactly a very mentally easy job.And then you look at how a lot get treated and how that’s gone.It’s difficult.</p><p>[SPEAKER 1]Yeah.Yeah, absolutely.It’s, we’re actually dealing with that right now.Um, and in Canada, my personal vet, um, she just relocated.Um, so, you know, we, in my area, we actually have a shortage, um, going on as well.It’s, uh, it’s.It’s pretty serious stuff.Um, just a quick, funny story though.Um, just telling about when I was saying, you know, working across the country, it got so burnt out, didn’t have a day off, anything like that.Wasn’t allowed to take time off. Um, I actually woke up like I, I was so burnt out.I was so exhausted.And, um, I woke up one time in the middle of the night, I was in my bedroom bent over and I was bandaging a horse in my dreams.I woke up, I was on the floor and I was like, what the heck am I doing?And it was, I just, like my, in my brain, it didn’t shut off.I didn’t, I wasn’t able to turn it off.It, it was, yeah, just a funny little story that you need to take the time.</p><p>[SPEAKER 2]I have never done that one.</p><p>[SPEAKER 1]Yeah, yeah.It’s never happened again.Thank goodness.But yeah, I woke up doing that. I’d love to discuss the future, you know, if there’s specific marketing trends or future directions that maybe you have a little bit of an insight on that, you know, whether you’re looking forward to them or you’re not looking forward to them that maybe you can you can share with us.</p><p>[SPEAKER 2]I mean, I think we’re going to start to see AI finding its place in our industry, right?Like in business and in our industry, whether it’s like the automation of scheduling, whether it’s maybe our, for instance, our dressage judging could actually be done by an AI, which would lead to more, maybe less bias, right?I don’t know, you know, things like that.I think we could see things like that in the future. in disciplines that maybe have human judges, right?Where you have judges from different nations.I think that might be. We could see that in gymnastics and things like that.I think that could be something I think, you know, we’re definitely going to start to see a lot more AI being introduced in terms of medical devices.I think also for horses and healthcare and stuff.I mean, if you actually like, look at some of the new technologies that are coming out in the human healthcare space with like, I mean, it’s crazy, like nanobot and different limbs and like. For instance, they’re developing different knee braces and things like that for skiers in high-performance training situations so that they can wear them and not tear.Basically, if you were gonna fall and rip your knee off or rip your leg, tear your meniscus, these knee injuries are really common in skiing, that this, it’s like a robotic brace for your leg, a boot, would actually reset it so that that injury didn’t happen to you. Wow, really cool stuff like that.If I was going to like what I think would happen in the next like 50 years I’d say maybe that kind of stuff we could see that coming in and and being really useful for horses to prevent injuries and things like that and I think it will be.I mean I don’t know maybe in the future we’ll even have different divisions, you know, for horses that have been, you know, Like, I don’t know, digitally assisted or technology assisted versus sources that have it.I think at the end of the day, one of the things that makes sports so unique is that people really do like to see it’s this.It’s like something about the human experience, right?It’s like this physical journey to get to push your body to the limits.And so I think once we start to add these elements in it, I think we might see like a big. separation and so I think in some ways that can be really exciting in terms of new products and veterinary care and stuff like that for horses and definitely in terms of like marketing and innovation it could be super fun like some of the projects to work on and things like that but I think that um but I also feel like as as our world becomes more digital and more superficial and we’re surrounded by you know a lot of these AI and things that make it so that things just come easily to us all the time I think that there will be more and more value to kind of these lost arts, if that makes any sense.I think the actual art and technique of really training horses in the same way. know you look at things like karate or some of these really refined things that require an astronomical amount of skill and like a lifetime to learn I think that those will have will have even more respect for those if that makes any sense in the future and I think that’s why like I personally feel like if you know we see a lot of people that just go out and they just buy a super expensive horse and like if you can afford to do that and you can buy a horse that’s that’s really well trained and super expensive and you can go have your you know glory and win all your ribbons i’m super happy for you for that that’s really what you want your journey to be you know but in the same vein i think that um there is something kind of like spiritual and unique about the human experience that you know it is physical it’s not it’s not technological it’s not analytical it is physical and so interacting with the horses as they are naturally and like body to body if that makes any sense physical to physical and like Training them and then they’re then performing and pushing their bodies to the max and doing all this for us Like I think that that’s the story we have to really protect and that’s what we have to Continue to tell and it has to be about you know in a world That’s like we always say oh everyone’s so connected now digitally, but they’re more and more lonely, right?I think the same is true start to be with all this AI stuff, but like we’re less physically connected to our physical world, like nature and things like that.And I think that, you know, a lot of these animals actually have a very big role to play as that world is as our world is changing to continue to ground us in, you know, interacting, you know, through touch.And I think that’s why, you know, you look at training horses is so special in that way, because it’s, There really isn’t another animal on the planet that we communicate with at the level that we do with just touch.When you really think about it, we train horses with pressure, and the absence of pressure, and how much pressure, and where we touch them, and when we touch them, and how we touch them, and they respond.</p><p>[SPEAKER 1]Not even touch, also energy. Right?Like, I mean, you don’t even… It can just be an energetic thing.</p><p>[SPEAKER 2]Exactly.Energy and voice.But I think really, I think for me, when I really look at it and compare it to, like, this AI, you know, aspect of things, for me, I really think it’s about this, like, what does it actually mean to be human?And what is it?What’s the physicality of it?Like, what’s the physical part of it?And I think for me, that’s why, you know, this is a very unique language, you know, that is… Between us and something in nature.It’s not even another human.I mean, it can’t tell us things and no matter how much I think any AI would want to predict horse behavior or things like that. I don’t think they can, you know, they’re living things, which is what, which is why so many of us love this sport, which I find, which is why I find it so interesting.And some people just want to like skip the whole training journey and the process of having that conversation with an animal and buy something that’s ready to go and then go do it.Like, where’s the fun in that?You know, at least for me, I mean, everybody can do what they want, but where’s the, where’s the connection in that?</p><p>[SPEAKER 1]Yeah.I completely agree.I think it’s, it’s. interesting that we see technology advancing more and more and more and more.And we also see places popping up that you can go and stay at that are like Wi-Fi unavailable zones.And it’s like, okay, so we’re so into our technology, but yet we have to get away from it and go like camp out in the woods where no one can get ahold of us.So I just, I think it’s, it’s an interesting.Yeah.</p><p>[SPEAKER 2]And I do think, I mean, like,</p><p>[SPEAKER 1]I don’t know.</p><p>[SPEAKER 2]I mean, I, I’m, I’m no like expert in that kind of thing, but I think, you know, energetically it does affect you.Like I, I don’t presume to know how Bluetooth works, but there’s like stuff going through the air and to assume that my body physically doesn’t feel that or acknowledge it.Maybe we’re just not to the point where we actually know how it does, you know?I don’t know.So I think that’s where I think horses are really cool and I think they’re beautiful.And I think that, um, they’re just like, you know, something really unique about being human.And I think that as our sport continues, as the world becomes more technical, as we start to see technology come together with sports. I think it’s gonna be really an interesting thing.</p><p>[SPEAKER 1]Yeah.Yeah, they definitely play a part in keeping us, like you said, keeping that human aspect in us.You know, I think every single person listening here can agree that you go to the barn and you lose track of time.And there’s something so beautiful in that, in my opinion, that you’re so in the present.You, you know, everything else around you just kind of goes away.You’re just in the barn.You’re with the horse. I think that that is something that is part of the reason why so many of us are addicted to this sport and to, you know, just being around horses is that it, it helps us really connect in and be so present.Um, I just, I think it’s beautiful.Yeah.That’s a, that’s a very good point.So continuing with our discussion on the future, what’s your hope for the future of the equestrian industry, technology, marketing, all of that aside, just the equestrian industry itself.</p><p>[SPEAKER 2]I think that, you know, with all of what we just talked about in mind, I think I really, I’m, I’m really hoping that just with all this stuff going on with like horse welfare and the direction that the sport, the governing bodies are going and how they’re judging, for instance, like the way that judges that were judging dressage horses, also the way that we’re allowing equipment to be used in the jumping and other disciplines, you know, and how hard we’re going to these governing bodies.I think for me, I really would like to see. I would just like to see more policies and more things in place to show, to protect our sport, really, from non-equestrians.And I think for people to really see that, you know, we do, because everybody gets into this work because we love the horses, you know, and people really love the horses.And so I think I’d like to see that.I’d like to see, you know, where the governing bodies of our sport are protecting our sport by putting forward more policies, rewarding more riding that’s harmonious, where they do try to really understand the experience of the animal and that they’re really coming together like we’re saying, like they’re connecting with us as humans in a way that you know doesn’t just isn’t just rewarding for us but could maybe be rewarding for someone who doesn’t know anything about horses that’s watching it as well and i think that’s really um you know i think that’s really where i’d hope that we go i’d like to see us go there in the future i completely agree i’d love to see our</p><p>[SPEAKER 1]Like you said, our judging and our policies and all that adjust to look at, OK, the movement might be fancy, but does the horse, like, does it look like it really hates doing it?Or is there total harmony happening with the horse and rider?And can we reward that more than the other things?So we have four questions that we ask every podcast guest.And they’re just meant to be like a quick, rapid fire question.And the first one is, do you have a motto or favorite saying?</p><p>[SPEAKER 2]I would say my number one saying is competence fuels confidence.You can’t be confident if you’re not competent, so don’t fake it.You have to go and learn how to do stuff, and then you’ll be confident.If you don’t feel confident, it’s because you’re probably not competent.The only way to do that is by doing the work.</p><p>[SPEAKER 1]Love that.</p><p>[SPEAKER 2]That’s a big one for me.</p><p>[SPEAKER 1]The second one is, who has been the most influential person in your equestrian journey?</p><p>[SPEAKER 2]I have two that would be hard.I have one that is like my personal life.You can say both.</p><p>[SPEAKER 1]Yeah.</p><p>[SPEAKER 2]Okay.So like a really good friend of mine.Her name is Lena. Um, I moved in with Lena at a very critical time in my life.Like she, um, had a little room to rent.It was right when I moved into that kind of dressage community with that mayor and she, um, just let me rent this room in her house.Like she’s a single lady from Sweden that loves horses and stuff.And, um, and I, and I, the rent was really cheap, which let me pay for my horses and stuff.So I knew I could still pay for it and stuff.And, um, I think that if I hadn’t lived with her in knowing how much she cared about the horses and the animals came first and doing all that, I never would have had the guts to start my business because it’s really scary when you have like a mouths to feed if you will right and to to start a business and to like not have a paycheck that someone else has to make sure there’s money to pay you and things like that and so even though like you save up for three months your head goes oh my god what about four months or five months or six months or you know all of that it’s just it’s very there is a jump off the ledge point to starting your own business that affects every entrepreneur like every single one And I think that, you know, she was like that person for me that like gave me a little bit of a feeling of a safety net.I think some people get that from their families, but for me, I was like 27 when I was doing this.And I just basically knew that if I failed, And I was like starving.She wouldn’t like, she’d let me not pay my rent so I could pay for my horse’s board.And then I could go get a job waitressing or doing, you know, something else just to pay her back.And she would like, she wasn’t the type of person who was going to just be like, you know, solve everything on your own.She was like, I think like really in my life, like one of my first in my professional life, like she was like a real safety net in my personal life. while still being really supportive of my own riding and riding and me having my own horses and I like never could have started my business without her like in any way you know she was that I lived with her for the first three years I started the business and and I think also like knowing that she like had my back made me a little bit fearless I So I was just like, all right, I’m going to do this.And there is that point as an entrepreneur where you have to have that attitude.You’re just going to do it and you’re just going to like fall on your face and get back up and you’re going to get a client and you’re going to do it wrong.And then you’re going to lose them and you’re going to do another one.And then, and you know, you’re just, you’re going to keep going.And, and I don’t think we could have done that without like living with her.And so, um, you know, I think that was like a big, that was a big thing.And then I’d say as a writer, I mean, I definitely have to, I give a lot of credit to Gareth.Gareth Hughes has been my coach and my mentor for For the past few years, I started riding with him originally when Sabine, um, had moved up to, to Northern California, um, over Skype and stuff and always with the intention of moving to the UK.And, um, and like really, you know, it was the same thing I knew from my, from my conversations with Sabine and just this understanding of a system, you know, that horses need to be trained in a system and that if you’re going to be a good rider and a good trainer of horses and make your own Grand Prix horses, then you need to learn a system.And so. And, you know, I wrote him a little letter and I was just like some chick in California and, and he started giving me, you know, with a horse that was too big.I mean, my, my, my, you know, PSG horse is 18 too, and she was too long and I couldn’t even put her together and make a round, you know, and all that.And I think a lot of riders at his level, like wouldn’t really have given someone like me the time of day for that.But I said, look, I know what you do.I know what you’re doing.I’m serious.Please teach me.And he was like, okay. You know, here I am, almost three years later, I live in another country, you know, have my horses here with him.I’m learning the system.I got that horse all the way from, you know, training level to doing her first Pre-St.George’s, you know.</p><p>[SPEAKER 1]And that’s the 18 too?</p><p>[SPEAKER 2]Yeah, she’s huge. And she has a phenomenal payoff.And he’s just like teaching me his system and teaching me his training method.I have a four year old also at Farm Out, we ride in the arena together every day and I think you know, it’s kind of like one of those things, if like Michael Jordan, you could go train with Michael Jordan every day, but you were like, not even a bar, like you weren’t even a varsity soccer player or varsity basketball player.You were like a player.And he was like, yeah, man, come on.It’s okay.</p><p>[SPEAKER 1]Yeah.</p><p>[SPEAKER 2]I’ll help you.If you really, really want to learn that bad that you’re going to pack your whole life and you’re going to move across the world.</p><p>[SPEAKER 1]Yeah, that’s it.Then I’ll do it.</p><p>[SPEAKER 2]And so, you know, I feel like. um because you do learn more when you’re in training in that environment you know and you do learn more when you’re in that system and then and then you look at all the you know just having that and like you were talking about this balance of your own goals and your own writing just having that and pushing forward in that my whole life is completely different than it was you know a few years ago like i’m i live in england you know so my whole life, all my friends, all my family, just everything is different now.So I think, you know, plus that, and then really learning a methodical system.So now I have, you know, like my four year old, I mean, it’s a little hit or miss with the spooking, because she’s a baby.But like, I mean, I’m able to take a four year old out and go get a 75%.You know, like, and just just from every day, it’s just like little by little brick by brick.So I’d have to say those are probably the two most influential and have changed my life in big ways, kind of people.</p><p>[SPEAKER 1]Yeah, The third one is, if you could give equestrians one piece of advice, what would it be?</p><p>[SPEAKER 2]That probably we shouldn’t take advice from each other and we should all just like do our own thing.</p><p>[SPEAKER 1]Stop giving unsolicited advice is the advice.</p><p>[SPEAKER 2]You know, I think it’s, but in that vein, I think like, you know, I think that there’s this book, and I think it’s by Podjowski.I think if I say his name right, I can send it to you after if you want to include a link or something, called My Horses, My Teachers.And Lena gave me that book, actually, and sat on my cell for three years, and then I read it, and it was really good.And the thing was, was that, you know, in his entire life, from the time he was a childhood all the way to like being at the Olympics and, you know, producing horses that went all over the world and did, I mean, he did the craziest stuff, right?And this was a generation that, like, they didn’t even have lorries.Like, he put, I mean, even just reading about, like, how they got the horses to the Olympics on a train.I was like, what?Like, they put the horses on a train, you know, and stuff like that.It’s just, just fascinating.And, but the thing that, it’s that, it’s not a it doesn’t need to be a sprint you don’t have to win everything tomorrow like it’s if you if you’re if you really love this sport and you really love the horses it’s a marathon you know it’s a a lifetime of horses like i think we should be learning you look at like you know people like carl um you don’t even look at charlotte i mean look how many horses she’s produced over and over and over again and how many more she probably will in her life you know it’s like it’s it’s I think that’s the thing I’d say is really ask yourself, is this a sprint or is it a marathon when you’re getting too tied up?Because I just feel like we’re in such a hyper-competitive world today that we put so much pressure on ourselves and way too much pressure on horses that are really just supposed to teach us things.I think that would be my thing.</p><p>[SPEAKER 1]I love that. The final one, please complete this sentence.</p><p>[SPEAKER 2]For me, horses are… I would say, like, my favorite thing about being a human.</p><p>[SPEAKER 1]Yeah.I agree.</p><p>[SPEAKER 2]Because if we really look at it on, like, a spiritual level, we probably don’t get to hang out with horses anywhere else physically, so… I know, it’s funny.</p><p>[SPEAKER 1]I always say, like, horses are what make me human.Like, they teach me more about being a human than humans teach me about being a human.Like, it’s such a… It’s such an interesting thing that we look to another creature to teach us about ourselves, but it’s undeniable.They do.Kelly, where can people find you and how can they connect with you?</p><p>[SPEAKER 2]Um, you can easily find me, um, you can contact us through our website.Those come straight to me, www.entry with an E, entryconsulting.com.Um, you can also always email me directly, kelly at entryconsulting.com.You can find me on Instagram, um, kelly underscore arts or via intrigue underscore marketing.So.All that I try to be pretty reachable.I’m pretty Google-able I think too.</p><p>[SPEAKER 1]So. Awesome.We’ll link all of that in the show notes, as well as the Ingrid Masterclass, like I had mentioned, the Ingrid Klimka Masterclass.And I just, I can’t thank you enough for your time today.It’s been an absolute pleasure speaking with you.Thank you so much for joining the podcast.</p><p>[SPEAKER 2]Thank you for having me.I really appreciate it.Thank you.</p><p>[SPEAKER 1]Thank you for listening to this episode of the Equestrian Connection podcast by WeHorse.If you enjoyed this episode, it would mean the world to us if you could leave us a rating and review, as well as share us on social media.You can find us on Instagram at wehorse underscore USA, and check out our free seven-day trial on wehorse.com, where you can access over 175 courses with top trainers from around the world in a variety of topics and disciplines. Until next time, be kind to yourself, your horses, and others.</p>